Discussion:
OT - New coronavirus clasifications
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Sid Nuncius
2020-10-12 14:24:46 UTC
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I surely can't be the only person to think that the new system of Threat
Levels should be called Tiers For Fears.
--
Sid
(Make sure Matron is away when you reply)
Nick Odell
2020-10-12 15:12:35 UTC
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On Mon, 12 Oct 2020 15:24:46 +0100, Sid Nuncius
Post by Sid Nuncius
I surely can't be the only person to think that the new system of Threat
Levels should be called Tiers For Fears.
Might you offer track two of their first studio album into the new,
combined Covid-19/1980s music thread?

Nick
Sid Nuncius
2020-10-12 18:30:36 UTC
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Post by Nick Odell
On Mon, 12 Oct 2020 15:24:46 +0100, Sid Nuncius
Post by Sid Nuncius
I surely can't be the only person to think that the new system of Threat
Levels should be called Tiers For Fears.
Might you offer track two of their first studio album into the new,
combined Covid-19/1980s music thread?
:o))
--
Sid
(Make sure Matron is away when you reply)
Rosalind Mitchell
2020-10-14 18:42:01 UTC
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Post by Nick Odell
On Mon, 12 Oct 2020 15:24:46 +0100, Sid Nuncius
Post by Sid Nuncius
I surely can't be the only person to think that the new system of Threat
Levels should be called Tiers For Fears.
Might you offer track two of their first studio album into the new,
combined Covid-19/1980s music thread?
If you're thinking of the one I'm thinking of, then it was then and is now.

R
John Ashby
2020-10-12 15:33:24 UTC
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Post by Sid Nuncius
I surely can't be the only person to think that the new system of Threat
Levels should be called Tiers For Fears.
I always said it would end in tiers.

john
Mike McMillan
2020-10-12 15:50:06 UTC
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Post by John Ashby
Post by Sid Nuncius
I surely can't be the only person to think that the new system of Threat
Levels should be called Tiers For Fears.
I always said it would end in tiers.
john
But cattle are safe as the commandment protects them; Though shalt not
Covid they neighbour’s Ox.
--
Toodle Pip (My other iPad is an old Pro
DavidK
2020-10-12 17:46:47 UTC
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Post by Mike McMillan
Though shalt not
Covid they neighbour’s Ox.
Should that not be "covid thy neighbour's bovid"
Philip Hole
2020-10-13 09:14:30 UTC
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Post by Sid Nuncius
I surely can't be the only person to think that the new system of Threat
Levels should be called Tiers For Fears.
Just looking at Tier1 and Tier2 side by side, Tier1 seems the more
aggressive.

eg:

Tier1 - you must wear face masks on public transport and in public
places, Fine £200.

Tier2 - no reference to face masks. No fine.

The other oddity is that they have the same conditions for eg schools,
but they are phrased slightly differently. Meanings are identical but
word order differs.

Why not let Public Health England local offices define which micro-area
has which Tier (or even better. local regulations)?

Flop
Sid Nuncius
2020-10-13 09:31:50 UTC
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Post by Philip Hole
Post by Sid Nuncius
I surely can't be the only person to think that the new system of
Threat Levels should be called Tiers For Fears.
Just looking at Tier1 and Tier2 side by side, Tier1 seems the more
aggressive.
Tier1 - you must wear face masks on public transport and in public
places, Fine £200.
Tier2 - no reference to face masks. No fine.
The other oddity is that they have the same conditions for eg schools,
but they are phrased slightly differently. Meanings are identical but
word order differs.
Well, they are the Tiers Of A Clown.
--
Sid
(Make sure Matron is away when you reply)
Clive Arthur
2020-10-13 11:05:50 UTC
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On 13/10/2020 10:31, Sid Nuncius wrote:

<snip>
Post by Sid Nuncius
Well, they are the Tiers Of A Clown.
'Tears of a Clown' was notable for it's use of a bassoon, but all we
have is a buffoon.
--
Cheers
Clive
Peter
2020-10-13 16:22:45 UTC
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Post by Clive Arthur
<snip>
Post by Sid Nuncius
Well, they are the Tiers Of A Clown.
'Tears of a Clown' was notable for it's use of a bassoon, but all we
have is a buffoon.
:-)
--
When, once, reference was made to a statesman almost universally
recognized as one of the villains of this century, in order to
induce him to a negative judgment, he replied: "My situation is
so different from his, that it is not for me to pass judgment".
Ernst Specker on Paul Bernays
Chris J Dixon
2020-10-13 09:34:33 UTC
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Post by Philip Hole
Just looking at Tier1 and Tier2 side by side, Tier1 seems the more
aggressive.
Tier1 - you must wear face masks on public transport and in public
places, Fine £200.
Tier2 - no reference to face masks. No fine.
have a look at
<https://www.gov.uk/guidance/local-covid-alert-levels-what-you-need-to-know>

It seems to be covered more comprehensively, and also says that
higher level precautions are in addition the lower ones.

Chris
--
Chris J Dixon Nottingham
'48/33 M B+ G++ A L(-) I S-- CH0(--)(p) Ar- T+ H0 ?Q
***@cdixon.me.uk @ChrisJDixon1
Plant amazing Acers.
Peter
2020-10-13 16:22:07 UTC
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Post by Philip Hole
Post by Sid Nuncius
I surely can't be the only person to think that the new system of
Threat Levels should be called Tiers For Fears.
Just looking at Tier1 and Tier2 side by side, Tier1 seems the more
aggressive.
Tier1 - you must wear face masks on public transport and in public
places, Fine £200.
Tier2 - no reference to face masks. No fine.
The other oddity is that they have the same conditions for eg schools,
but they are phrased slightly differently. Meanings are identical but
word order differs.
Why not let Public Health England local offices define which micro-area
has which Tier (or even better. local regulations)?
If they were to do so, they probably have no power to enforce it. Also,
one of the complaints (from people who are a bit slow, maybe) about
local variations is that they are confusing. Micro-areas would mean
(for those people at least) more confusion. People might live, work and
shop in three different micro-areas.
Post by Philip Hole
Flop
--
When, once, reference was made to a statesman almost universally
recognized as one of the villains of this century, in order to
induce him to a negative judgment, he replied: "My situation is
so different from his, that it is not for me to pass judgment".
Ernst Specker on Paul Bernays
krw
2020-10-14 09:23:42 UTC
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If they were to do so, they probably have no power to enforce it.  Also,
one of the complaints (from people who are a bit slow, maybe) about
local variations is that they are confusing.  Micro-areas would mean
(for those people at least) more confusion.  People might live, work and
shop in three different micro-areas.
Accidentally watching the news last night apparently people in Madrid
are confused by what the local government is doing and the National
Government does not like it so has issued a different set of rules to be
enforced.

Can anyone demonstrate that any of it is actually improving the situation?
--
Kosmo Richard W
www.travelswmw.whitnet.uk
https://tinyurl.com/KRWpics
Vicky Ayech
2020-10-14 10:12:31 UTC
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Post by krw
If they were to do so, they probably have no power to enforce it.  Also,
one of the complaints (from people who are a bit slow, maybe) about
local variations is that they are confusing.  Micro-areas would mean
(for those people at least) more confusion.  People might live, work and
shop in three different micro-areas.
Accidentally watching the news last night apparently people in Madrid
are confused by what the local government is doing and the National
Government does not like it so has issued a different set of rules to be
enforced.
Can anyone demonstrate that any of it is actually improving the situation?
I don't think so. And the vehemence of the criticism of people who do
not obey all the very small details and instructions worries me.

I chat at the swimming pool to a lady who spent the first 18 years of
her life in the now Czech Republic. She's been in the UK since and is
in her 40s now. She was 15 when the regime changed so remembers
clearly how it was. People obeyed minute instructions and were
encouraged to report those who didn't. As some leaders have suggested
here.
krw
2020-10-14 10:13:54 UTC
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Post by Vicky Ayech
People obeyed minute instructions and were
encouraged to report those who didn't.
That approach is deeply disturbing to me. But the last time I said that
I crossed a line.
--
Kosmo Richard W
www.travelswmw.whitnet.uk
https://tinyurl.com/KRWpics
Vicky Ayech
2020-10-14 10:38:07 UTC
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Post by krw
Post by Vicky Ayech
People obeyed minute instructions and were
encouraged to report those who didn't.
That approach is deeply disturbing to me. But the last time I said that
I crossed a line.
A line here? Did someone suggest that? I missed it.
I have noticed many jokes and memes about various aspects of the rules
for dealing with the virus but no serious criticism from any of my
friends. Which surprises me. And some of them are vocal in the
condemnation etc.
Peter
2020-10-14 17:38:39 UTC
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Post by Vicky Ayech
People obeyed minute instructions and were
encouraged to report those who didn't.
That approach is deeply disturbing to me.  But the last time I said that
I crossed a line.
We have been living in a police state for some time. What COVID-19 has
done is made it plain that we are living in a police state.
--
When, once, reference was made to a statesman almost universally
recognized as one of the villains of this century, in order to
induce him to a negative judgment, he replied: "My situation is
so different from his, that it is not for me to pass judgment".
Ernst Specker on Paul Bernays
Sid Nuncius
2020-10-14 18:15:51 UTC
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Post by Vicky Ayech
People obeyed minute instructions and were
encouraged to report those who didn't.
That approach is deeply disturbing to me.  But the last time I said
that I crossed a line.
We have been living in a police state for some time.  What COVID-19 has
done is made it plain that we are living in a police state.
No we aren't.

We live in a state in which the police may have more powers to interfere
with citizens' behaviour than you may like. That is not the same thing
as a police state, which is a totalitarian state controlled by a
political police force that secretly supervises the citizens' activities
and systematically acts to enforce the political will of the government.
Whatever the flaws of our political system and of our police force,
the UK cannot be truthfully described in such terms.

I do have concerns about erosion of civil liberties, but personally I
think it is reasonable at the moment to enforce measures to control
Covid-19, provided that those measures are lawfully introduced and
lawfully enforced, and that the enforcement is proportional to any
non-compliance. You may well disagree, and that's a legitimate point of
view. However, it is simply untrue to say that we have been living in a
police state for some time.
--
Sid
(Make sure Matron is away when you reply)
BrritSki
2020-10-14 19:07:11 UTC
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Post by Sid Nuncius
Post by Vicky Ayech
People obeyed minute instructions and were
encouraged to report those who didn't.
That approach is deeply disturbing to me.  But the last time I said
that I crossed a line.
We have been living in a police state for some time.  What COVID-19
has done is made it plain that we are living in a police state.
No we aren't.
We live in a state in which the police may have more powers to interfere
with citizens' behaviour than you may like.  That is not the same thing
as a police state, which is a totalitarian state controlled by a
political police force that secretly supervises the citizens' activities
and systematically acts to enforce the political will of the government.
 Whatever the flaws of our political system and of our police force,
the UK cannot be truthfully described in such terms.
I do have concerns about erosion of civil liberties, but personally I
think it is reasonable at the moment to enforce measures to control
Covid-19, provided that those measures are lawfully introduced and
lawfully enforced, and that the enforcement is proportional to any
non-compliance.  You may well disagree, and that's a legitimate point of
view.  However, it is simply untrue to say that we have been living in a
police state for some time.
<LW> BJ is trying to do an impossible job. He's getting a lot wrong, but
when people shout at him to follow the science, he should just reply
"which science?".

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