Discussion:
OT - equality petition needed redrafting.
(too old to reply)
J. P. Gilliver (John)
2018-10-08 18:06:50 UTC
Permalink
The first attempt at the petition was rejected because "It’s not clear
what the petition is asking the UK Government or Parliament to do." I
would have thought it was fairly clear, but - sigh - it was obviously
dealt with by the sort of person who normally handles customer service
enquiries. I'd hoped for a higher level of comprehension from civil
servants ...

So, we have to go through the process all over again (and the petition
is more limited). If those who were kind enough to help before, could
again ... thanks in advance.


In message
<0102016654bd1a07-0daf9af4-aca7-4da1-841e-688548cdc96e-***@eu-west-1.a
mazonses.com>, "Petitions: UK Government and Parliament"
Dear J. P. Gilliver,
You’re not done yet!
Forward the email below to your potential supporters.
5 people need to click the link and confirm their support for us to
publish your petition.
Thanks,
The Petitions team
UK Government and Parliament
--
I've made a petition – will you sign it?
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/230003/sponsors/new?token=gHafDVBYobumelL9J54c
Pass laws that petitions, such as this, must collect votes both for and
against.
Frequently, petitions and similar are reported as having collected so
many thousand votes. This only represents one side: without knowing how
strong the opposing feeling is, the true public opinion can be
misreported - and, decision-makers can be pushed into actions the
majority don't actually want.
A petition is arguably the modern version of the pitchfork-wielding
mob; it's very easy for individuals or groups to whip up strong
feelings. Those opposing the motion feel disenfranchised - there is no
*simple* and *immediate* way to register their opposition; they can
only set up a counter-petition, which is liable to be rejected, or at
least involves a delay, thus giving unfair advantage to the first petition.
Such laws could in time be extended to apply to other similar opinion
mechanisms.
--
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/230003/sponsors/new?token=gHafDVBYobumelL9J54c
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

"Bother," said Pooh, as Windows crashed into piglet.
Serena Blanchflower
2018-10-09 10:50:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
The first attempt at the petition was rejected because "It’s not clear
what the petition is asking the UK Government or Parliament to do." I
would have thought it was fairly clear, but - sigh - it was obviously
dealt with by the sort of person who normally handles customer service
enquiries. I'd hoped for a higher level of comprehension from civil
servants ...
So, we have to go through the process all over again (and the petition
is more limited). If those who were kind enough to help before, could
again ... thanks in advance.
In message
mazonses.com>, "Petitions: UK Government and Parliament"
Dear J. P. Gilliver,
You’re not done yet!
Forward the email below to your potential supporters.
5 people need to click the link and confirm their support for us to
publish your petition.
Thanks,
The Petitions team
UK Government and Parliament
--
I've made a petition – will you sign it?
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/230003/sponsors/new?token=gHafDVBYobumelL9J54c
Pass laws that petitions, such as this, must collect votes both for
and against.
Frequently, petitions and similar are reported as having collected so
many thousand votes. This only represents one side: without knowing
how strong the opposing feeling is, the true public opinion can be
misreported - and, decision-makers can be pushed into actions the
majority don't actually want.
 A petition is arguably the modern version of the pitchfork-wielding
mob; it's very easy for individuals or groups to whip up strong
feelings. Those opposing the motion feel disenfranchised - there is no
*simple* and *immediate* way to register their opposition; they can
only set up a counter-petition, which is liable to be rejected, or at
least involves a delay, thus giving unfair advantage to the first petition.
Such laws could in time be extended to apply to other similar opinion
mechanisms.
--
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/230003/sponsors/new?token=gHafDVBYobumelL9J54c
I could see the point in asking the government to change their petition
platform so that it would also allow people to actively disagree with it
but making one sided petitions illegal is going too far, in my opinion.

This would make it illegal for someone who is campaigning (not
necessarily through an online platform, let alone through the government
petition system) to do so, without also setting up, and maintaining, a
platform for their opponents. This seems unreasonably onerous to me.
--
Best wishes, Serena
I am not in this world to live up to other people's expectations, nor do
l feel that the world must live up to mine (Fritz Perl)
J. P. Gilliver (John)
2018-10-09 20:17:23 UTC
Permalink
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/230003/sponsors/new?token=gHafDVBYobumelL9J54c
[]
Post by Serena Blanchflower
I could see the point in asking the government to change their petition
platform so that it would also allow people to actively disagree with
Well, that would be good.
Post by Serena Blanchflower
it but making one sided petitions illegal is going too far, in my
opinion.
This would make it illegal for someone who is campaigning (not
necessarily through an online platform, let alone through the
government petition system) to do so, without also setting up, and
maintaining, a platform for their opponents. This seems unreasonably
onerous to me.
I take your point. I'm sure all the details could (and would!) be
discussed endlessly, were the petition to get the required number of
votes: a petition getting that far doesn't guarantee anything (10k
requires a government _response_ [such as "we think this is
ridiculous"], 100k requires the proposal be _discussed_ in parliament).
Since last time I looked, this second version had only received two
votes other than me (it needs five - other than me - before it's even
laid open to _consideration_). So I don't think you have to worry )-:.

(Naturally, if anyone _does_ want to support it, and/or mention it on
any other medium, I'd be delighted. [If it gets as far as being
released, you won't be able to vote _against_ it - which is the point!])
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

The death of democracy is not likely to be an assassination from ambush.
It will be a slow extinction from apathy, indifference, and undernourishment.
-Robert Maynard Hutchins, educator (1899-1977)
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