Discussion:
Lament for a long-dead program
(too old to reply)
Anne B
2020-12-20 14:25:43 UTC
Permalink
Micro$oft-haters please ignore.

<rant> In the course of trying to send out Christmas greetings by
e-mail, I am once again driven to lament the passing of Outlook Express.

There was a setting on OE whereby any address I actually sent to to was
automatically added to my address book. Then when I wanted to send
another e-mail to the same person it came up with all addresses on file
for that individual, which often alerted me to, and enabled me to find
and delete, out-of-date ones.

I can't find a similar setting in Outlook.

Both OE and Outlook feature a means of creating a group of addresses to
which the same message can be sent without having to re-type the names
of all recipents separately. But Outlook does not update this list when
I change the e-mail addresses in the address book/contacts list, whereas
OE did. So I end up with a fistful of undeliverable messages sent to
obsolete addresses in spite of having the correct e-mail addresses on file.

And Outlook seems to delete automatically from the contacts list/address
book any address if a message to it has been bounced, but the address,
stripped of all information that might allow it to be recognised,
remains in the group, even if I click on 'Update Group'. It's OK if the
e-mail address contains the name of its owner, but many don't, so I know
that someone who should have received a message hasn't, but it takes a
lot of time comparing lists to work out who it was.

And in Outlook, if I want to add an address manually (which of course
was never necessary in OE because addresses were added automatically), I
often have to specify how I want the name to be listed because it wants
to default to listing only the e-mail address.

Lastly, when I have finally added the address manually, and go to add it
to the group, it asks me whether I want to add them from my contacts
list or my address book. I would have expected those to be one and the
same, but if they are not, what is the difference, and why is there
nothing in the help (nothing that I can find, at any rate) to tell me?

I wish I didn't have such a large e-mail archive. If I didn't I would
willingly ditch Outlook for something more rational, but I am afraid of
losing it if I try to switch, and with rampant Covid-19 about my techy
pal can't come and help me sort it all out.

</rant>

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!

Anne B
Steve Hague
2020-12-20 16:45:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Anne B
Micro$oft-haters please ignore.
<rant> In the course of trying to send out Christmas greetings by
e-mail, I am once again driven to lament the passing of Outlook Express.
There was a setting on OE whereby any address I actually sent to to was
automatically added to my address book. Then when I wanted to send
another e-mail to the same person it came up with all addresses on file
for that individual, which often alerted me to, and enabled me to find
and delete, out-of-date ones.
I can't find a similar setting in Outlook.
Both OE and Outlook feature a means of creating a group of addresses to
which the same message can be sent without having to re-type the names
of all recipents separately. But Outlook does not update this list when
I change the e-mail addresses in the address book/contacts list, whereas
OE did. So I end up with a fistful of undeliverable messages sent to
obsolete addresses in spite of having the correct e-mail addresses on file.
And Outlook seems to delete automatically from the contacts list/address
book any address if a message to it has been bounced, but the address,
stripped of all information that might allow it to be recognised,
remains in the group, even if I click on 'Update Group'. It's OK if the
e-mail address contains the name of its owner, but many don't, so I know
that someone who should have received a message hasn't, but it takes a
lot of time comparing lists to work out who it was.
And in Outlook, if I want to add an address manually (which of course
was never necessary in OE because addresses were added automatically), I
often have to specify how I want the name to be listed because it wants
to default to listing only the e-mail address.
Lastly, when I have finally added the address manually, and go to add it
to the group, it asks me whether I want to add them from my contacts
list or my address book. I would have expected those to be one and the
same, but if they are not, what is the difference, and why is there
nothing in the help (nothing that I can find, at any rate) to tell me?
I wish I didn't have such a large e-mail archive. If I didn't I would
willingly ditch Outlook for something more rational, but I am afraid of
losing it if I try to switch, and with rampant Covid-19 about my techy
pal can't come and help me sort it all out.
</rant>
Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!
Anne B
OE was excellent, and I too mourn its passing. I use Thunderbird these
days, but it's not as good as OE. In my experience it randomly flips the
view from ascending to descending, and threaded to unthreaded.
Philip Hole
2020-12-20 17:42:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steve Hague
Post by Anne B
Micro$oft-haters please ignore.
<rant> In the course of trying to send out Christmas greetings by
e-mail, I am once again driven to lament the passing of Outlook Express.
There was a setting on OE whereby any address I actually sent to to
was automatically added to my address book. Then when I wanted to send
another e-mail to the same person it came up with all addresses on
file for that individual, which often alerted me to, and enabled me to
find and delete, out-of-date ones.
I can't find a similar setting in Outlook.
Both OE and Outlook feature a means of creating a group of addresses
to which the same message can be sent without having to re-type the
names of all recipents separately. But Outlook does not update this
list when I change the e-mail addresses in the address book/contacts
list, whereas OE did. So I end up with a fistful of undeliverable
messages sent to obsolete addresses in spite of having the correct
e-mail addresses on file.
And Outlook seems to delete automatically from the contacts
list/address book any address if a message to it has been bounced, but
the address, stripped of all information that might allow it to be
recognised, remains in the group, even if I click on 'Update Group'.
It's OK if the e-mail address contains the name of its owner, but many
don't, so I know that someone who should have received a message
hasn't, but it takes a lot of time comparing lists to work out who it
was.
And in Outlook, if I want to add an address manually (which of course
was never necessary in OE because addresses were added automatically),
I often have to specify how I want the name to be listed because it
wants to default to listing only the e-mail address.
Lastly, when I have finally added the address manually, and go to add
it to the group, it asks me whether I want to add them from my
contacts list or my address book. I would have expected those to be
one and the same, but if they are not, what is the difference, and why
is there nothing in the help (nothing that I can find, at any rate) to
tell me?
I wish I didn't have such a large e-mail archive. If I didn't I would
willingly ditch Outlook for something more rational, but I am afraid
of losing it if I try to switch, and with rampant Covid-19 about my
techy pal can't come and help me sort it all out.
</rant>
Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!
Anne B
OE was excellent, and I too mourn its passing. I use Thunderbird these
days, but it's not as good as OE. In my experience it randomly flips the
view from ascending to descending, and threaded to unthreaded.
I would suggest that you try Thunderbird.

You should be able to run both/either.

Thunderbird will import everything or just addressbook or emails or
settings (en bloc)

Having copied your address book, you can then add lists.
Eg 'Christmas' contacts.

If the address is in your 'collected' lists, just drag it into your
group list. (Or CTRL copy any number of them at once and drop them in
the group list.

When you write an email, for addressee just put Christmas and it will
become <Christmas> with all the group in it.

There are a lot of extra features which you will discover when you want
them.

However, as Steve said, it has introduced a few hiccups such as changing
display format unintentionally.

I really would give it a try.

--

Flop
Anne B
2020-12-20 21:52:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by Philip Hole
Post by Steve Hague
Post by Anne B
Micro$oft-haters please ignore.
<rant> In the course of trying to send out Christmas greetings by
e-mail, I am once again driven to lament the passing of Outlook Express.
There was a setting on OE whereby any address I actually sent to to
was automatically added to my address book. Then when I wanted to
send another e-mail to the same person it came up with all addresses
on file for that individual, which often alerted me to, and enabled
me to find and delete, out-of-date ones.
I can't find a similar setting in Outlook.
Both OE and Outlook feature a means of creating a group of addresses
to which the same message can be sent without having to re-type the
names of all recipents separately. But Outlook does not update this
list when I change the e-mail addresses in the address book/contacts
list, whereas OE did. So I end up with a fistful of undeliverable
messages sent to obsolete addresses in spite of having the correct
e-mail addresses on file.
And Outlook seems to delete automatically from the contacts
list/address book any address if a message to it has been bounced,
but the address, stripped of all information that might allow it to
be recognised, remains in the group, even if I click on 'Update
Group'. It's OK if the e-mail address contains the name of its owner,
but many don't, so I know that someone who should have received a
message hasn't, but it takes a lot of time comparing lists to work
out who it was.
And in Outlook, if I want to add an address manually (which of course
was never necessary in OE because addresses were added
automatically), I often have to specify how I want the name to be
listed because it wants to default to listing only the e-mail address.
Lastly, when I have finally added the address manually, and go to add
it to the group, it asks me whether I want to add them from my
contacts list or my address book. I would have expected those to be
one and the same, but if they are not, what is the difference, and
why is there nothing in the help (nothing that I can find, at any
rate) to tell me?
I wish I didn't have such a large e-mail archive. If I didn't I would
willingly ditch Outlook for something more rational, but I am afraid
of losing it if I try to switch, and with rampant Covid-19 about my
techy pal can't come and help me sort it all out.
</rant>
Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!
Anne B
OE was excellent, and I too mourn its passing. I use Thunderbird these
days, but it's not as good as OE. In my experience it randomly flips
the view from ascending to descending, and threaded to unthreaded.
I would suggest that you try Thunderbird.
You should be able to run both/either.
Thunderbird will import everything or just addressbook or emails or
settings (en bloc)
Having copied your address book, you can then add lists.
Eg 'Christmas' contacts.
If the address is in your 'collected' lists, just drag it into your
group list. (Or CTRL copy any number of them at once and drop them in
the group list.
When you write an email, for addressee just put Christmas and it will
become <Christmas> with all the group in it.
There are a lot of extra features which you will discover when you want
them.
However, as Steve said, it has introduced a few hiccups such as changing
display format unintentionally.
I really would give it a try.
--
Flop
Thank you. I use Thunderbird for newsgroups, but have consistently
failed to get it to work with e-mail. Once Santa has delivered that
elusive round tuit, I may try again.

Anne B
Serena Blanchflower
2020-12-20 22:14:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Anne B
Thank you. I use Thunderbird for newsgroups, but have consistently
failed to get it to work with e-mail. Once Santa has delivered that
elusive round tuit, I may try again.
What problem(s) do you hit, when you try to use it for e-mail?
--
Best wishes, Serena
It does not do to leave a live dragon out of your calculations, if you
live near him. (J. R. R. Tolkien)
Anne B
2020-12-23 11:13:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by Serena Blanchflower
Post by Anne B
Thank you. I use Thunderbird for newsgroups, but have consistently
failed to get it to work with e-mail. Once Santa has delivered that
elusive round tuit, I may try again.
What problem(s) do you hit, when you try to use it for e-mail?
It just tells me it can't connect to the server, and TBH I CBA - sorry I
mean CBB - to spend ages trying to figure out why.

Anne B
Serena Blanchflower
2020-12-23 11:43:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Anne B
Post by Serena Blanchflower
Post by Anne B
Thank you. I use Thunderbird for newsgroups, but have consistently
failed to get it to work with e-mail. Once Santa has delivered that
elusive round tuit, I may try again.
What problem(s) do you hit, when you try to use it for e-mail?
It just tells me it can't connect to the server, and TBH I CBA - sorry I
mean CBB - to spend ages trying to figure out why.
Is the email address you're trying to set up, the same address/id that
you use to sign into your email host?

I know I've been caught this way, with TB, in the past trying to set it
up for my normal email address. TB can't work out my email host from my
domain address and isn't too happy. I have to tell TB that I'm trying
to set it up for my gmail address (as that's my email host) and only
correct the "From:" address afterwards.
--
Best wishes, Serena
Think it possible that you may be mistaken. (Quaker Advices and Queries #17)
Anne B
2020-12-23 18:03:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Serena Blanchflower
Post by Anne B
Post by Serena Blanchflower
Post by Anne B
Thank you. I use Thunderbird for newsgroups, but have consistently
failed to get it to work with e-mail. Once Santa has delivered that
elusive round tuit, I may try again.
What problem(s) do you hit, when you try to use it for e-mail?
It just tells me it can't connect to the server, and TBH I CBA - sorry
I mean CBB - to spend ages trying to figure out why.
Is the email address you're trying to set up, the same address/id that
you use to sign into your email host?
Thank you.

Yes, it's my main e-mail address and the 'master' e-mail address.

I have wondered if TB has noticed that it's not the same as the munged
e-mail address that appears if you try to reply to ne on UMRA, and that
is why it doesn't like it.
Post by Serena Blanchflower
I know I've been caught this way, with TB, in the past trying to set it
up for my normal email address.  TB can't work out my email host from my
domain address and isn't too happy.  I have to tell TB that I'm trying
to set it up for my gmail address (as that's my email host) and only
correct the "From:" address afterwards.
I don't think it should have that sort of problem with mine, which is
probably one of the commonest ISPs in the UK.

As I said, I am hoping for a delivery from Santa, along with a few more
years so that I have time for all the stuff I need to do before using
said round tuit.

Anne B
Serena Blanchflower
2020-12-23 19:56:20 UTC
Permalink
Post by Anne B
As I said, I am hoping for a delivery from Santa, along with a few more
years so that I have time for all the stuff I need to do before using
said round tuit.
If/when you find the necessary tuit, if you look on Google, there's a
good chance that you'll find a guide from your ISP on how to set up TB,
or another email client, to access your mail.
--
Best wishes, Serena
Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines!
Anne B
2020-12-24 10:55:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by Serena Blanchflower
Post by Anne B
As I said, I am hoping for a delivery from Santa, along with a few
more years so that I have time for all the stuff I need to do before
using said round tuit.
If/when you find the necessary tuit, if you look on Google, there's a
good chance that you'll find a guide from your ISP on  how to set up TB,
or another email client, to access your mail.
Thanks :)

Anne B

krw
2020-12-23 13:23:16 UTC
Permalink
On reading the subject line I thought I was actually going to get a
message concerning "The Archers".

I use Thunderbird - which for the charity which can afford IT support is
a nuisance because they cannot understand why I would want anything
other than Microsoft. And whilst I have never made it to the Linux boat
I do try to avoid Microsoft some of the time.

Did I tell umra that trying to "repair" Excel to make it work wiped it
from my hard drive? That took the biscuit.
--
Kosmo Richard W
www.travelswmw.whitnet.uk
https://tinyurl.com/KRWpics
Steve Hague
2020-12-23 14:26:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by krw
On reading the subject line I thought I was actually going to get a
message concerning "The Archers".
I use Thunderbird - which for the charity which can afford IT support is
a nuisance because they cannot understand why I would want anything
other than Microsoft.  And whilst I have never made it to the Linux boat
I do try to avoid Microsoft some of the time.
Did I tell umra that trying to "repair" Excel to make it work wiped it
from my hard drive?  That took the biscuit.
I tried to install Linux a few years ago after hearing how much better
it was than Windows. It was time consuming, and in the end futile. I
came to the conclusion that Linux users were either much cleverer than
me, or OS snobs. Perhaps both.
Steve
Vicky Ayech
2020-12-23 18:38:03 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 23 Dec 2020 14:26:41 +0000, Steve Hague
Post by Steve Hague
Post by krw
On reading the subject line I thought I was actually going to get a
message concerning "The Archers".
I use Thunderbird - which for the charity which can afford IT support is
a nuisance because they cannot understand why I would want anything
other than Microsoft.  And whilst I have never made it to the Linux boat
I do try to avoid Microsoft some of the time.
Did I tell umra that trying to "repair" Excel to make it work wiped it
from my hard drive?  That took the biscuit.
I tried to install Linux a few years ago after hearing how much better
it was than Windows. It was time consuming, and in the end futile. I
came to the conclusion that Linux users were either much cleverer than
me, or OS snobs. Perhaps both.
Steve
I installed (with help) a version of it in the early 1990s, before it
emulated windows at all. It was on a dual book laptop. Then I tried
another version a while later.They are always having new ones. I
think linux users just like installing and fixing stuff. The thing
is we were closer to the time before WWW then. Then they had to make
linux do the WWW htings and it was just easier to have a windows
system and not bother. Some things did work better and use less memory
faster with linux though.
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