Discussion:
Affordable Housing?
(too old to reply)
Btms
2018-07-08 20:17:33 UTC
Permalink
Saw a planning app today. Eight affordable houses. In that area I doubt
there is any property that would be valued at less than 500K . So based on
affordable means sold for average in the area, I will be interested to see
what happens next. Very few folk would afford 500K or anything like.
the Omrud
2018-07-09 08:06:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by Btms
Saw a planning app today. Eight affordable houses. In that area I doubt
there is any property that would be valued at less than 500K . So based on
affordable means sold for average in the area, I will be interested to see
what happens next. Very few folk would afford 500K or anything like.
There is a definition of Affordable Housing for rental properties (which
requires a rent of no more than 80% of the local market rent). But I'm
not aware of any definition relating to houses to purchase, so it can
mean whatever the person speaking wants it to mean.
--
David
Btms
2018-07-09 13:26:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by the Omrud
Post by Btms
Saw a planning app today. Eight affordable houses. In that area I doubt
there is any property that would be valued at less than 500K . So based on
affordable means sold for average in the area, I will be interested to see
what happens next. Very few folk would afford 500K or anything like.
There is a definition of Affordable Housing for rental properties (which
requires a rent of no more than 80% of the local market rent). But I'm
not aware of any definition relating to houses to purchase, so it can
mean whatever the person speaking wants it to mean.
So it means nothing all!
--
BTMS - Equine Advisor Extraordinaire.
Jenny M Benson
2018-07-09 15:53:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by Btms
Post by the Omrud
Post by Btms
Saw a planning app today. Eight affordable houses. In that area I doubt
there is any property that would be valued at less than 500K . So based on
affordable means sold for average in the area, I will be interested to see
what happens next. Very few folk would afford 500K or anything like.
There is a definition of Affordable Housing for rental properties (which
requires a rent of no more than 80% of the local market rent). But I'm
not aware of any definition relating to houses to purchase, so it can
mean whatever the person speaking wants it to mean.
So it means nothing all!
Of course it means nothing at all. It's a phrase which really p****s me
off. There must be millions of us in this country who cannot and never
will be able to afford to buy our own house - unless "affordable" is
made to mean priced in tens rather than thousands of pounds. £50,000 is
affordable for SOME people. A couple of million is affordable for SOME
people. What a STUPID expression it is.
--
Jenny M Benson
http://jennygenes.blogspot.co.uk/
J. P. Gilliver (John)
2018-07-09 16:22:27 UTC
Permalink
In message <***@mid.individual.net>, Jenny M Benson
<***@hotmail.co.uk> writes:
[]
Post by Jenny M Benson
Of course it means nothing at all. It's a phrase which really p****s
me off. There must be millions of us in this country who cannot and
never will be able to afford to buy our own house - unless "affordable"
is made to mean priced in tens rather than thousands of pounds. £50,000
is affordable for SOME people. A couple of million is affordable for
SOME people. What a STUPID expression it is.
Go on, tell us how you _really_ feel (-:.

I agree: it is a phrase that, if it ever _did_ have any meaning, has
lost all of it.

I'm still bemused by why property prices have done what they have, on
supply and demand principles: 30 years ago, say, it was possible for
_many_ people to anticipate owning their own home by a reasonable point
in their life, and the population hasn't changed _that_ much over that
time; therefore the only supply/demand aspect that has changed is
household size, i. e. a lot more people want to live alone than did say
fifty years ago (young singles vs. young couples). But surely that
demographic change must be about due to have worked its way through by
now, so why the astronomical change in prices (and I mean in real terms,
say number of years average wage)?

The only explanation I can think of is something other than supply and
demand, such as speculation; if that is the reason, it's depressing, and
"something needs to be done" - but I don't know what, and usually the
first _several_ "somethings" that come to mind are wrong. ("Something
needs to be done": "this is something, so let's do it.") You can't
_just_ "punish" speculators by, say, heavily taxing any difference
between what people bought at and what they sell at, because that
punishes those who just want to move (or downsize or upsize), rather
than profit; if prices _have_ gone up, people _have_ to ask more than
they paid, in order to be able to afford what they're going to. (It is
also a disincentive to improvement, such as insulation or double
glazing.) I don't have an easy answer; assuming speculation _is_ the
cause of the problem, any disincentive to/punishment of speculation will
be messy to avoid punishing the innocent.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

But this can only happen if we replace the urge to blame with the urge to
learn so that it is safe for staff to admit errors and raise concerns without
the fear of being punished.
- Former MI5 boss Eliza Manningham-Buller, RT 2016/5/7-13
Clive Arthur
2018-07-09 16:45:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
[]
Of course it means nothing at all.  It's a phrase which really p****s
me off.  There must be millions of us in this country who cannot and
never will be able to afford to buy our own house - unless
"affordable" is made to mean priced in tens rather than thousands of
pounds. £50,000 is affordable for SOME people.  A couple of million is
affordable for SOME people.  What a STUPID expression it is.
Go on, tell us how you _really_ feel (-:.
I agree: it is a phrase that, if it ever _did_ have any meaning, has
lost all of it.
I'm still bemused by why property prices have done what they have, on
supply and demand principles: 30 years ago, say, it was possible for
_many_ people to anticipate owning their own home by a reasonable point
in their life, and the population hasn't changed _that_ much over that
time; therefore the only supply/demand aspect that has changed is
household size, i. e. a lot more people want to live alone than did say
fifty years ago (young singles vs. young couples). But surely that
demographic change must be about due to have worked its way through by
now, so why the astronomical change in prices (and I mean in real terms,
say number of years average wage)?
The only explanation I can think of is something other than supply and
demand, such as speculation; if that is the reason, it's depressing, and
"something needs to be done" - but I don't know what, and usually the
first _several_ "somethings" that come to mind are wrong. ("Something
needs to be done": "this is something, so let's do it.") You can't
_just_ "punish" speculators by, say, heavily taxing any difference
between what people bought at and what they sell at, because that
punishes those who just want to move (or downsize or upsize), rather
than profit; if prices _have_ gone up, people _have_ to ask more than
they paid, in order to be able to afford what they're going to. (It is
also a disincentive to improvement, such as insulation or double
glazing.) I don't have an easy answer; assuming speculation _is_ the
cause of the problem, any disincentive to/punishment of speculation will
be messy to avoid punishing the innocent.
It is mostly supply and demand, I think. The supply is limited because
many are able to buy to let. It seems to me that such a basic need
should be better regulated, but I suppose many of the powers that be
make a considerable income from this.

Cheers
--
Clive
Mike Ruddock
2018-07-10 07:45:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
[]
Of course it means nothing at all.  It's a phrase which really p****s
me off.  There must be millions of us in this country who cannot and
never will be able to afford to buy our own house - unless
"affordable" is made to mean priced in tens rather than thousands of
pounds. £50,000 is affordable for SOME people.  A couple of million is
affordable for SOME people.  What a STUPID expression it is.
Go on, tell us how you _really_ feel (-:.
I agree: it is a phrase that, if it ever _did_ have any meaning, has
lost all of it.
I'm still bemused by why property prices have done what they have, on
supply and demand principles: 30 years ago, say, it was possible for
_many_ people to anticipate owning their own home by a reasonable point
in their life, and the population hasn't changed _that_ much over that
time; therefore the only supply/demand aspect that has changed is
household size, i. e. a lot more people want to live alone than did say
fifty years ago (young singles vs. young couples). But surely that
demographic change must be about due to have worked its way through by
now, so why the astronomical change in prices (and I mean in real terms,
say number of years average wage)?
The only explanation I can think of is something other than supply and
demand, such as speculation; if that is the reason, it's depressing, and
"something needs to be done" - but I don't know what, and usually the
first _several_ "somethings" that come to mind are wrong. ("Something
needs to be done": "this is something, so let's do it.") You can't
_just_ "punish" speculators by, say, heavily taxing any difference
between what people bought at and what they sell at, because that
punishes those who just want to move (or downsize or upsize), rather
than profit; if prices _have_ gone up, people _have_ to ask more than
they paid, in order to be able to afford what they're going to. (It is
also a disincentive to improvement, such as insulation or double
glazing.) I don't have an easy answer; assuming speculation _is_ the
cause of the problem, any disincentive to/punishment of speculation will
be messy to avoid punishing the innocent.
Some of the effect JPG points to can be accounted for by, yes,
speculation (there are many places in London where houses are standing
empty, being investments by rich people who actually live abroad. Then
there is the rise of the "second home" - it seems as though for those
with the means the acquisition of a holiday home (which stays unoccupied
for much of the year) is nowadays mandatory. We have friends who live in
Yarmouth (IoW) and they tell us that the place is like a morgue during
the winter since many of the houses are either second ho,mes otr holiday
lets.
That this is only a secondary effect in driving upo house prices I
admit. The failure of successive governments to crack the whip on the
building firms is the prime cause in my opinion - in other words it is
supply and demand.

Mike Ruddock
Penny
2018-07-10 10:44:55 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, 10 Jul 2018 08:45:48 +0100, Mike Ruddock
Post by Mike Ruddock
it is
supply and demand.
It's always bemused me.

Husgod's father*, a fitter in one of the local paper mills in Kent, bought
a semi-detached house in 1936 for a 3 figure sum. A few years later he
built a garage onto the house which cost him a 4 figure sum.

The house last sold in 2008 for £298,000, Zoopla currently value it at over
£400,000.

I have no idea how these prices relate to a worker's pay, but from the
office of national statistics I learn the prices (all in decimal money) in
1936 of a
large white loaf 1.5p
pack of sugar 2.1p
pack of butter 3.4p
pint of milk 1.3p
dozen eggs 8.8p
1lb cheddar 8.3p
I presume meat prices are per pound
Beef rib 12.2p
Mutton leg 13.8p

* He wasn't known for his financial acumen. He was badly injured at work
and after recovering decided he would become a shopkeeper. The story goes,
without reference to his wife and family he sold the house and bought a
shop (with living accommodation above) in the nearby town. After a few
weeks he decided this didn't suit him - wife and family went to stay at her
sister's boarding house in Ramsgate for the summer - they never owned a
house again but returned to rent half a house in their original home
village.
--
Penny
Annoyed by The Archers since 1959
J. P. Gilliver (John)
2018-07-10 16:11:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by Penny
On Tue, 10 Jul 2018 08:45:48 +0100, Mike Ruddock
Post by Mike Ruddock
it is
supply and demand.
It's always bemused me.
Husgod's father*, a fitter in one of the local paper mills in Kent, bought
a semi-detached house in 1936 for a 3 figure sum. A few years later he
built a garage onto the house which cost him a 4 figure sum.
The house last sold in 2008 for £298,000, Zoopla currently value it at over
£400,000.
I have no idea how these prices relate to a worker's pay, but from the
[]
I find
http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/bills/article-1633409/Historic-inflation-calculator-value-money-changed-1900.html
very useful for this sort of thing. Using that to convert to today's
money:
a 3-figure sum in 1936 would be between 6,760 and 67k5
298k in 2008 would be 393k
(400k now is 400k)
So in terms of actual equivalent purchases (RPI, which is what that page
uses), it's actually not gone up that much in 20 years (but has in 82).

Of course, that doesn't take account of other matters, like changes in
salaries - which up to between 20 and 10 years ago rose a lot _faster_
than RPI inflation, and recently have lagged behind it (though not by
much, not least because inflation itself has been low - even RPI, which
is higher than CPI which governments prefer for that reason [but you can
still find out what RPI is if you dig for it - currently 3.4% IIRR]). I
use this most of the time. If you want a more wishy-washy version,
https://www.measuringworth.com/calculators/ukcompare/ will give you
several figures - for the 298k in 2008, it gives 344k to 386k in 2017
(it won't give this year).
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Veni Vidi Vacuum [I came, I saw, It sucked] - ***@saslimited.demon.co.uk, 1998
J. P. Gilliver (John)
2018-07-10 15:50:35 UTC
Permalink
In message <***@mid.individual.net>, Mike Ruddock
<***@btinternet.com> writes:
[]
Post by Mike Ruddock
That this is only a secondary effect in driving upo house prices I
admit. The failure of successive governments to crack the whip on the
building firms is the prime cause in my opinion - in other words it is
supply and demand.
Mike Ruddock
But: demand has gone up by 15% in 30 years due to population as onerat
kindly provided, and there's the rise in second homes granted (though
that's mostly in holiday areas, I presume); and surely the demographic
change of more single households has worked its way through (i. e. has
been the case for somewhat more than 30 years). But let's say
population, second homes, and smaller households has pushed demand up by
50% - or even 100%. Property prices have gone up by hugely more than
that, in 30 years.

You're probably right about the failure of governments (of all colours)
to crack the whip on building firms - but what would you make them do?
If build lots of small homes, then it is only partly the building firms
that are at fault: it's the planners (especially where they don't
incorporate sequencing into any planning grant, and enforce it).

I think there should be a lot more (is there _any_ now?) council
building. And of flats, too (maybe not high-rose towers, but say 5 to 7
storeys); however, there's a strong aversion to flats in the British
psyche. (Odd, in that a lot of the demand _is_ - or would be if there
was any supply - from young single people, who don't have _time_ to
garden, or desire, other than what a few window-boxes on balconies would
satisfy.) I don't know _why_ there's such an aversion to flats - other
than maybe the problems of tower blocks designed very much down to a
price in the 1950s and '60s. (The aversion was there long before
Grenfell.)
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

If a cluttered desk is characteristic of a cluttered mind, what does an empty
desk mean ?
Vicky Ayech
2018-07-10 17:05:28 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, 10 Jul 2018 16:50:35 +0100, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
I think there should be a lot more (is there _any_ now?) council
building. And of flats, too (maybe not high-rose towers, but say 5 to 7
storeys); however, there's a strong aversion to flats in the British
psyche. (Odd, in that a lot of the demand _is_ - or would be if there
was any supply - from young single people, who don't have _time_ to
garden, or desire, other than what a few window-boxes on balconies would
satisfy.) I don't know _why_ there's such an aversion to flats - other
than maybe the problems of tower blocks designed very much down to a
price in the 1950s and '60s. (The aversion was there long before
Grenfell.)
I agree there should be more council houses and they could be built
more cheaply if the councils were not planning to sell them at some
point. The materials that can be used have to be those that will allow
the homes to get mortgages, which limits it. Homes can be built with
materials that are safe and sustainable and long-lasting but would
not get mortgages if being sold to private buyers.
J. P. Gilliver (John)
2018-07-10 19:00:45 UTC
Permalink
In message <***@4ax.com>, Vicky Ayech
<***@gmail.com> writes:
[]
Post by Vicky Ayech
I agree there should be more council houses and they could be built
more cheaply if the councils were not planning to sell them at some
point. The materials that can be used have to be those that will allow
the homes to get mortgages, which limits it. Homes can be built with
materials that are safe and sustainable and long-lasting but would
not get mortgages if being sold to private buyers.
Don't get me started on construction materials/methods. I'll just say
that prefabricated modules mass-made in factories ought to be _far_ more
widely used. Especially for flats, but even for houses. The current
obsession with using blocks - either little brown ones (bricks) or
bigger grey ones - puzzles me greatly.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Her [Valerie Singleton's] main job on /Blue Peter/ was to stop unpredictable
creatres running amok. And that was just John Noakes.
- Alison Pearson, RT 2014/9/6-12
Penny
2018-07-10 23:28:19 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, 10 Jul 2018 20:00:45 +0100, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
Don't get me started on construction materials/methods. I'll just say
that prefabricated modules mass-made in factories ought to be _far_ more
widely used. Especially for flats, but even for houses. The current
There is a company here which makes modular housing www.f1modular.co.uk I
thought they'd had to give up a couple of years back due to cash flow
problems but I'm pleased to see they were bought up and are still going.
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
obsession with using blocks - either little brown ones (bricks) or
bigger grey ones - puzzles me greatly.
The two major housing association developments locally in recent years - 3
storey* flats for the elderly and 3 storey flats for younger people plus
some 2/3 bedroom houses - appeared to be timber framed, lots of kingspan
insulation board then clad with brick.

* This being, historically, a woolen mill town, 3/4 storey buildings sort
of fit in, although some (not the new ones) are built into the hillside
with access at two levels, not unlike those in Hebden Bridge.
--
Penny
Annoyed by The Archers since 1959
Fenny
2018-07-10 20:43:45 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, 10 Jul 2018 18:05:28 +0100, Vicky Ayech
Post by Vicky Ayech
I agree there should be more council houses and they could be built
more cheaply if the councils were not planning to sell them at some
point. The materials that can be used have to be those that will allow
the homes to get mortgages, which limits it. Homes can be built with
materials that are safe and sustainable and long-lasting but would
not get mortgages if being sold to private buyers.
The councils would prefer not to have to sell off council houses, but
the government have told them they have to. Those councils that do
have the reserves to build houses would like to, but know it's just a
way of throwing the cash away, as they will be sold for a pittance and
then flogged by the new owners for a fortune.
--
Fenny
J. P. Gilliver (John)
2018-07-11 02:00:50 UTC
Permalink
In message <***@4ax.com>, Fenny
<***@removethis.gmail.com> writes:
[]
Post by Fenny
The councils would prefer not to have to sell off council houses, but
the government have told them they have to. Those councils that do
Is that still the case? If so, I agree it needs amending.
Post by Fenny
have the reserves to build houses would like to, but know it's just a
way of throwing the cash away, as they will be sold for a pittance and
I thought the only ones sold for a pittance were to tenants who'd lived
in them for most of their lives. I don't mind that (it can't account for
more than a tiny proportion by now) ...
Post by Fenny
then flogged by the new owners for a fortune.
... but that needs stopping: if they bought them at say 20% of market
value, they should not be able to sell them for more than that, or say
25% after at least a year, 30% after at least two, and so on. Or, if
they sell them for more, they should have to hand over the surplus to
the council. The _point_ of selling cheap to those who'd been paying
council rents for most of their life was so that they could remain
housed, not to make them rich.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

[What's your guilty pleasure?] Why should you feel guilty about pleasure? -
Michel Roux Jr in Radio Times 2-8 February 2013
Flop
2018-07-11 07:35:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
... but that needs stopping: if they bought them at say 20% of market
value, they should not be able to sell them for more than that, or say
25% after at least a year, 30% after at least two, and so on. Or, if
they sell them for more, they should have to hand over the surplus to
the council. The _point_ of selling cheap to those who'd been paying
council rents for most of their life was so that they could remain
housed, not to make them rich.
https://www.gov.uk/right-to-buy-buying-your-council-home/selling-your-home

Up to 10 years there are conditions.
--
Flop

“I needed a password eight characters long so I picked Snow White and
the Seven Dwarves.”
J. P. Gilliver (John)
2018-07-11 22:21:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by Flop
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
... but that needs stopping: if they bought them at say 20% of market
value, they should not be able to sell them for more than that, or say
25% after at least a year, 30% after at least two, and so on. Or, if
they sell them for more, they should have to hand over the surplus to
the council. The _point_ of selling cheap to those who'd been paying
council rents for most of their life was so that they could remain
housed, not to make them rich.
https://www.gov.uk/right-to-buy-buying-your-council-home/selling-your-home
Up to 10 years there are conditions.
Yes, but not very onerous; thanks for that link. The amount of the
discount you got, that you have to give back, reduces by *20%* a year -
so you can keep _all_ of it if you sell after only 5 years. The
up-to-10-years condition is only who you can sell it to (and even then
you're not tied to them if they don't buy within 8 weeks of you asking
them); you can still ask full market price.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

After all is said and done, usually more is said.
Chris McMillan
2018-07-12 17:36:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
Post by Flop
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
... but that needs stopping: if they bought them at say 20% of market
value, they should not be able to sell them for more than that, or say
25% after at least a year, 30% after at least two, and so on. Or, if
they sell them for more, they should have to hand over the surplus to
the council. The _point_ of selling cheap to those who'd been paying
council rents for most of their life was so that they could remain
housed, not to make them rich.
https://www.gov.uk/right-to-buy-buying-your-council-home/selling-your-home
Up to 10 years there are conditions.
Yes, but not very onerous; thanks for that link. The amount of the
discount you got, that you have to give back, reduces by *20%* a year -
so you can keep _all_ of it if you sell after only 5 years. The
up-to-10-years condition is only who you can sell it to (and even then
you're not tied to them if they don't buy within 8 weeks of you asking
them); you can still ask full market price.
Just typed in the road name I wanted, in Clapham. a five bed Victorian
terrace, over 2 million!!! Eeeeeekkkkkk!

Sincerely Chris
Btms
2018-07-10 22:39:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Vicky Ayech
On Tue, 10 Jul 2018 16:50:35 +0100, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
I think there should be a lot more (is there _any_ now?) council
building. And of flats, too (maybe not high-rose towers, but say 5 to 7
storeys); however, there's a strong aversion to flats in the British
psyche. (Odd, in that a lot of the demand _is_ - or would be if there
was any supply - from young single people, who don't have _time_ to
garden, or desire, other than what a few window-boxes on balconies would
satisfy.) I don't know _why_ there's such an aversion to flats - other
than maybe the problems of tower blocks designed very much down to a
price in the 1950s and '60s. (The aversion was there long before
Grenfell.)
I agree there should be more council houses and they could be built
more cheaply if the councils were not planning to sell them at some
point. The materials that can be used have to be those that will allow
the homes to get mortgages, which limits it. Homes can be built with
materials that are safe and sustainable and long-lasting but would
not get mortgages if being sold to private buyers.
Where will the money come from to build Council houses? I know, let’s
start a poll tax.
--
BTMS - Equine Advisor Extraordinaire.
Mike
2018-07-11 06:19:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by Btms
Post by Vicky Ayech
On Tue, 10 Jul 2018 16:50:35 +0100, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
I think there should be a lot more (is there _any_ now?) council
building. And of flats, too (maybe not high-rose towers, but say 5 to 7
storeys); however, there's a strong aversion to flats in the British
psyche. (Odd, in that a lot of the demand _is_ - or would be if there
was any supply - from young single people, who don't have _time_ to
garden, or desire, other than what a few window-boxes on balconies would
satisfy.) I don't know _why_ there's such an aversion to flats - other
than maybe the problems of tower blocks designed very much down to a
price in the 1950s and '60s. (The aversion was there long before
Grenfell.)
I agree there should be more council houses and they could be built
more cheaply if the councils were not planning to sell them at some
point. The materials that can be used have to be those that will allow
the homes to get mortgages, which limits it. Homes can be built with
materials that are safe and sustainable and long-lasting but would
not get mortgages if being sold to private buyers.
Where will the money come from to build Council houses? I know, let’s
start a poll tax.
Are you Thatching a plan there?
--
Toodle Pip
krw
2018-07-10 17:57:57 UTC
Permalink
But let's say population, second homes, and smaller households has
pushed demand up by 50% - or even 100%. Property prices have gone up by
hugely more than that, in 30 years.
Demand and price are not a straight line relation. If demand increases
and supply is limited then price may increase exponentially. Housing
prices demonstrate that.
--
Kosmo Richard W
www.travelswmw.whitnet.uk
https://tinyurl.com/KRWpics
steveski
2018-07-11 02:04:23 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, 10 Jul 2018 16:50:35 +0100, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:

[]
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
I think there should be a lot more (is there _any_ now?) council
building.
If *that woman* hadn't directed the money from the sale of council
properties into the Treasury's coffers instead of to the councils' (to
build new stock) we wouldn't have this problem.
--
Steveski

(The last council tenant in a row of houses designed for elderly/disabled
where the new *owners* (leasehold) are wondering about why the light
switches are in a funny position - sigh)
Btms
2018-07-11 06:58:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by steveski
[]
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
I think there should be a lot more (is there _any_ now?) council
building.
If *that woman* hadn't directed the money from the sale of council
properties into the Treasury's coffers instead of to the councils' (to
build new stock) we wouldn't have this problem.
I am not sure. Council houses were subsidised and cost the ratepayers (as
we were then) money, so there was no surplus to invest. I recall my fil
bought his council house at a very reduced interest rate for a sum less
than we paid for our first house (which was pretty awful). Our interest
rate was much higher and our income much lower than his. We now live in
what was a Council house that was sold back in the day. According to
Zoopla, its worth an eye watering sum now.
--
BTMS - Equine Advisor Extraordinaire.
Chris McMillan
2018-07-12 15:55:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Btms
Post by steveski
[]
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
I think there should be a lot more (is there _any_ now?) council
building.
If *that woman* hadn't directed the money from the sale of council
properties into the Treasury's coffers instead of to the councils' (to
build new stock) we wouldn't have this problem.
I am not sure. Council houses were subsidised and cost the ratepayers (as
we were then) money, so there was no surplus to invest. I recall my fil
bought his council house at a very reduced interest rate for a sum less
than we paid for our first house (which was pretty awful). Our interest
rate was much higher and our income much lower than his. We now live in
what was a Council house that was sold back in the day. According to
Zoopla, its worth an eye watering sum now.
I may well find out how much my dad bought his council house for in 1968,
I’ll certainly be knowing what it might sell for by the end of the year. A
small fortune. OTOH step mum has in her time sold a three storey plus
basement terrace house in Clapham in the late 70s, followed by a flat (at
least I think it was a buy, not a rent) in the famous Du Cane Court in
Balham, but her mum wasn’t in there more than five yrs, maybe not even
that. Those prices would be chicken feed noe of course! Zoopla!

Sincerely Chris
Sally Thompson
2018-07-12 20:13:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris McMillan
Post by Btms
Post by steveski
[]
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
I think there should be a lot more (is there _any_ now?) council
building.
If *that woman* hadn't directed the money from the sale of council
properties into the Treasury's coffers instead of to the councils' (to
build new stock) we wouldn't have this problem.
I am not sure. Council houses were subsidised and cost the ratepayers (as
we were then) money, so there was no surplus to invest. I recall my fil
bought his council house at a very reduced interest rate for a sum less
than we paid for our first house (which was pretty awful). Our interest
rate was much higher and our income much lower than his. We now live in
what was a Council house that was sold back in the day. According to
Zoopla, its worth an eye watering sum now.
I may well find out how much my dad bought his council house for in 1968,
I’ll certainly be knowing what it might sell for by the end of the year. A
small fortune. OTOH step mum has in her time sold a three storey plus
basement terrace house in Clapham in the late 70s, followed by a flat (at
least I think it was a buy, not a rent) in the famous Du Cane Court in
Balham, but her mum wasn’t in there more than five yrs, maybe not even
that. Those prices would be chicken feed noe of course! Zoopla!
My cousin has a tiny flat in Du Cane (bought, not rented) which she lets me
borrow when I go to London!

Very nice and central.
--
Sally in Shropshire, UK
Chris McMillan
2018-07-13 07:59:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Sally Thompson
Post by Chris McMillan
Post by Btms
Post by steveski
[]
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
I think there should be a lot more (is there _any_ now?) council
building.
If *that woman* hadn't directed the money from the sale of council
properties into the Treasury's coffers instead of to the councils' (to
build new stock) we wouldn't have this problem.
I am not sure. Council houses were subsidised and cost the ratepayers (as
we were then) money, so there was no surplus to invest. I recall my fil
bought his council house at a very reduced interest rate for a sum less
than we paid for our first house (which was pretty awful). Our interest
rate was much higher and our income much lower than his. We now live in
what was a Council house that was sold back in the day. According to
Zoopla, its worth an eye watering sum now.
I may well find out how much my dad bought his council house for in 1968,
I’ll certainly be knowing what it might sell for by the end of the year. A
small fortune. OTOH step mum has in her time sold a three storey plus
basement terrace house in Clapham in the late 70s, followed by a flat (at
least I think it was a buy, not a rent) in the famous Du Cane Court in
Balham, but her mum wasn’t in there more than five yrs, maybe not even
that. Those prices would be chicken feed noe of course! Zoopla!
My cousin has a tiny flat in Du Cane (bought, not rented) which she lets me
borrow when I go to London!
Very nice and central.
I can’t remember much about it as we were married then, I worked in Lunnon
but it was a rare visit by invitation rather than joining mum and dad on
high days and holidays trips but step mum said until recently she remembers
the servants bells still present in the flat and it was on the cooler side
of the building.

Not been anywhere Clapham since the early 80s, never needed to. Mum does
have one friend still somewhere thereabouts but that’s all.

Sincerely Chris
Sally Thompson
2018-07-13 13:21:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris McMillan
Post by Sally Thompson
Post by Chris McMillan
OTOH step mum has in her time sold a three storey plus
basement terrace house in Clapham in the late 70s, followed by a flat (at
least I think it was a buy, not a rent) in the famous Du Cane Court in
Balham, but her mum wasn’t in there more than five yrs, maybe not even
that. Those prices would be chicken feed noe of course! Zoopla!
My cousin has a tiny flat in Du Cane (bought, not rented) which she lets me
borrow when I go to London!
Very nice and central.
I can’t remember much about it as we were married then, I worked in Lunnon
but it was a rare visit by invitation rather than joining mum and dad on
high days and holidays trips but step mum said until recently she remembers
the servants bells still present in the flat and it was on the cooler side
of the building.
The servants’ bells don’t appear to work these days:-)
--
Sally in Shropshire, UK
Jenny M Benson
2018-07-13 14:53:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Sally Thompson
Post by Chris McMillan
I can’t remember much about it as we were married then, I worked in Lunnon
but it was a rare visit by invitation rather than joining mum and dad on
high days and holidays trips but step mum said until recently she remembers
the servants bells still present in the flat and it was on the cooler side
of the building.
The servants’ bells don’t appear to work these days:-)
My grandparents' house had a Servants' bell system which was still
working in the 1950s. We children loved to press one of the bell-pushes
then rush to the kitchen to look at the indicator.

Whether the bells were ever used in earnest to summon the live-in maid
they had for many years, at least into the late 1940s, I don't know.
She was an elderly Welsh lady who wore the standard maid's uniform of
black dress, white pinny & cap and called me "Jiniver". I was TERRIFIED
of her, which was unfortunate because she adored children and I think
must have been very hurt that I screamed every time I saw her.
--
Jenny M Benson
http://jennygenes.blogspot.co.uk/
Btms
2018-07-13 15:43:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jenny M Benson
Post by Sally Thompson
Post by Chris McMillan
I can’t remember much about it as we were married then, I worked in Lunnon
but it was a rare visit by invitation rather than joining mum and dad on
high days and holidays trips but step mum said until recently she remembers
the servants bells still present in the flat and it was on the cooler side
of the building.
The servants’ bells don’t appear to work these days:-)
My grandparents' house had a Servants' bell system which was still
working in the 1950s. We children loved to press one of the bell-pushes
then rush to the kitchen to look at the indicator.
Whether the bells were ever used in earnest to summon the live-in maid
they had for many years, at least into the late 1940s, I don't know.
She was an elderly Welsh lady who wore the standard maid's uniform of
black dress, white pinny & cap and called me "Jiniver". I was TERRIFIED
of her, which was unfortunate because she adored children and I think
must have been very hurt that I screamed every time I saw her.
We had bells and servants. I was not allowed to ring the bells. I was
sent with a message if needed.
--
BTMS - Equine Advisor Extraordinaire.
J. P. Gilliver (John)
2018-07-13 17:34:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jenny M Benson
Post by Sally Thompson
Post by Chris McMillan
I can’t remember much about it as we were married then, I worked in Lunnon
but it was a rare visit by invitation rather than joining mum and dad on
high days and holidays trips but step mum said until recently she remembers
the servants bells still present in the flat and it was on the cooler side
of the building.
The servants’ bells don’t appear to work these days:-)
My grandparents' house had a Servants' bell system which was still
working in the 1950s. We children loved to press one of the
bell-pushes then rush to the kitchen to look at the indicator.
[]
I was born in 1960, and can remember (so must have been 1964+) moving
into somewhere that still had such an electromechanical (I think)
system. I _think_ it might have been army quarters in Dortmund; if it
wasn't, it was a terraced (Victorian) house in Eaglescliffe, Yorkshire
(the first home I remember from more than photographs).
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

... the greatest musical festival in the world that doesn't involve mud.
- Eddie Mair, RT 2014/8/16-22
Chris J Dixon
2018-07-14 06:55:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jenny M Benson
My grandparents' house had a Servants' bell system which was still
working in the 1950s. We children loved to press one of the bell-pushes
then rush to the kitchen to look at the indicator.
The family house was a Victorian semi, and it originally had a
bell board in the kitchen, and many of the wires and linkages
were still in place. If you pulled on the wires in the attic, you
could still hear movement behind the bell board location. One of
the original bells on its coiled spring mount was still lying in
the cellar.

Clearly the servant accommodation had been in the attic, because
there was a separate bell pull running directly there from the
master bedroom beneath.

The next generation - an electric bell board with several flag
indicators - was still in place, but not working, when we moved
in around 1955.

Chris
--
Chris J Dixon Nottingham
'48/33 M B+ G++ A L(-) I S-- CH0(--)(p) Ar- T+ H0 ?Q
***@cdixon.me.uk
Plant amazing Acers.
Chris McMillan
2018-07-13 15:40:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by Sally Thompson
Post by Chris McMillan
Post by Sally Thompson
Post by Chris McMillan
OTOH step mum has in her time sold a three storey plus
basement terrace house in Clapham in the late 70s, followed by a flat (at
least I think it was a buy, not a rent) in the famous Du Cane Court in
Balham, but her mum wasn’t in there more than five yrs, maybe not even
that. Those prices would be chicken feed noe of course! Zoopla!
My cousin has a tiny flat in Du Cane (bought, not rented) which she lets me
borrow when I go to London!
Very nice and central.
I can’t remember much about it as we were married then, I worked in Lunnon
but it was a rare visit by invitation rather than joining mum and dad on
high days and holidays trips but step mum said until recently she remembers
the servants bells still present in the flat and it was on the cooler side
of the building.
The servants’ bells don’t appear to work these days:-)
Doubt they did then either. :) mum’s completely lost most of her memory
now very quickly over 8 months.

Sincerely Chris
Penny
2018-07-13 21:03:39 UTC
Permalink
On 13 Jul 2018 13:21:05 GMT, Sally Thompson
The servants’ bells don’t appear to work these days:-)
I vaguely recall they did work in the house I grew up in but were
disconnected by my father when he replaced bell pushes with 2 pin sockets
and made use of the circuitry to put speakers in some rooms, connected to
the single household wireless. Probably so we could all listen to The
Archers while eating supper.
--
Penny
Annoyed by The Archers since 1959
Kate B
2018-07-13 22:01:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Penny
On 13 Jul 2018 13:21:05 GMT, Sally Thompson
Post by Sally Thompson
The servants’ bells don’t appear to work these days:-)
I vaguely recall they did work in the house I grew up in but were
disconnected by my father when he replaced bell pushes with 2 pin sockets
and made use of the circuitry to put speakers in some rooms, connected to
the single household wireless. Probably so we could all listen to The
Archers while eating supper.
That was very enterprising! We still have the circuits in our house
(1912, it says on a drainpipe, though I suspect these bells are from the
thirties). There are still bell pushes in several rooms, if you depress
them there is a nasty dull buzzing from the box in the kitchen, though
the room tell-tales don't all work very well. Perhaps they rang properly
once upon a time. We also have an ancient electric doorbell which
irritates the bell in the kitchen - it doesn't exactly ring, it wobbles
crossly.
--
Kate B
London
Penny
2018-07-13 22:11:30 UTC
Permalink
On Fri, 13 Jul 2018 23:01:34 +0100, Kate B <***@nospam.demon.co.uk>
scrawled in the dust...
Post by Kate B
Post by Penny
On 13 Jul 2018 13:21:05 GMT, Sally Thompson
The servants’ bells don’t appear to work these days:-)
I vaguely recall they did work in the house I grew up in but were
disconnected by my father when he replaced bell pushes with 2 pin sockets
and made use of the circuitry to put speakers in some rooms, connected to
the single household wireless. Probably so we could all listen to The
Archers while eating supper.
That was very enterprising!
Our next house had no such system but he rigged up something similar to
connect up a speaker in the kitchen which could be switched on/off.

In my old timber framed place I made use of various gaps between walls and
timbers to run the TV signal to several rooms - much harder to do neatly in
a more 'modern' house - current one built in 1950 with horribly hard
internal brick walls.
Post by Kate B
We still have the circuits in our house
(1912, it says on a drainpipe, though I suspect these bells are from the
thirties). There are still bell pushes in several rooms, if you depress
them there is a nasty dull buzzing from the box in the kitchen, though
the room tell-tales don't all work very well. Perhaps they rang properly
once upon a time. We also have an ancient electric doorbell which
irritates the bell in the kitchen - it doesn't exactly ring, it wobbles
crossly.
I love that description! :)
--
Penny
Annoyed by The Archers since 1959
BrritSki
2018-07-14 06:14:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Penny
scrawled in the dust...
Post by Kate B
Post by Penny
On 13 Jul 2018 13:21:05 GMT, Sally Thompson
Post by Sally Thompson
The servants’ bells don’t appear to work these days:-)
I vaguely recall they did work in the house I grew up in but were
disconnected by my father when he replaced bell pushes with 2 pin sockets
and made use of the circuitry to put speakers in some rooms, connected to
the single household wireless. Probably so we could all listen to The
Archers while eating supper.
That was very enterprising!
Our next house had no such system but he rigged up something similar to
connect up a speaker in the kitchen which could be switched on/off.
We can afford more than 1 radio, but they don't work very well for R4 in
Italy. So we have a little wireless transmitter connected to the TV/HiFi
and a speaker in the bedroom and another in the kitchen so we can listen
to whatever is "on the TV" in bed or while cooking.
Post by Penny
Post by Kate B
irritates the bell in the kitchen - it doesn't exactly ring, it wobbles
crossly.
I love that description! :)
YANAOU
the Omrud
2018-07-14 07:39:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by BrritSki
Post by Penny
scrawled in the dust...
Post by Kate B
Post by Penny
On 13 Jul 2018 13:21:05 GMT, Sally Thompson
Post by Sally Thompson
The servants’ bells don’t appear to work these days:-)
I vaguely recall they did work in the house I grew up in but were
disconnected by my father when he replaced bell pushes with 2 pin
sockets and made use of the circuitry to put speakers in some rooms,
connected to the single household wireless. Probably so we could all listen to The
Archers while eating supper.
That was very enterprising!
Our next house had no such system but he rigged up something similar to
connect up a speaker in the kitchen which could be switched on/off.
We can afford more than 1 radio, but they don't work very well for R4 in
Italy. So we have a little wireless transmitter connected to the TV/HiFi
and a speaker in the bedroom and another in the kitchen so we can listen
to whatever is "on the TV" in bed or while cooking.
We used to do that, but I'm now using Internet radio. An old Android
phone works perfectly; you can connect it to speakers, directly or
bluetooth, and you can use the iPlayer.

Won't work for TV of course, unless you have a VPN.
--
David
BrritSki
2018-07-14 12:57:33 UTC
Permalink
We used to do that, but I'm now using Internet radio.  An old Android
phone works perfectly;  you can connect it to speakers, directly or
bluetooth, and you can use the iPlayer.
Won't work for TV of course, unless you have a VPN.
Fortunately we DO have a VPN (Identity Cloaker, 5*) and this is the
method we will use for TV when we go back after house sale and want to
watch TV with no 1.4m dish to receive a satellite signal.
the Omrud
2018-07-14 16:41:20 UTC
Permalink
Post by BrritSki
We used to do that, but I'm now using Internet radio.  An old Android
phone works perfectly;  you can connect it to speakers, directly or
bluetooth, and you can use the iPlayer.
Won't work for TV of course, unless you have a VPN.
Fortunately we DO have a VPN (Identity Cloaker, 5*) and this is the
method we will use for TV when we go back after house sale and want to
watch TV with no 1.4m dish to receive a satellite signal.
If you will be setting up a UK home with broadband, the cheapest
solution to getting a UK-hosted VPN is a Raspberry Pi connected to your
router. The broadcasters can't tell whether you're in your UK home or
elsewhere.
--
David
Vicky Ayech
2018-07-14 17:13:26 UTC
Permalink
Farming Today was about affordable housing this week. A minister
suggested they should have a rule for councils selling their houses of
one out two in, which sounds good. They just need funds to build and
if they can do so with the cheaper but sustainable and lasting
materials then could build lots more.
the Omrud
2018-07-14 17:19:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by Vicky Ayech
Farming Today was about affordable housing this week. A minister
suggested they should have a rule for councils selling their houses of
one out two in, which sounds good. They just need funds to build and
if they can do so with the cheaper but sustainable and lasting
materials then could build lots more.
IIRC, since the 1970s, local authorities have not been permitted to
borrow money to build new council houses. The minister should change
the rules.
--
David
Btms
2018-07-14 18:03:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by Vicky Ayech
Farming Today was about affordable housing this week. A minister
suggested they should have a rule for councils selling their houses of
one out two in, which sounds good. They just need funds to build and
if they can do so with the cheaper but sustainable and lasting
materials then could build lots more.
Are there any Council houses left to sell?
--
BTMS - Equine Advisor Extraordinaire.
Mike
2018-07-14 18:08:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by the Omrud
Post by BrritSki
We used to do that, but I'm now using Internet radio.  An old Android
phone works perfectly;  you can connect it to speakers, directly or
bluetooth, and you can use the iPlayer.
Won't work for TV of course, unless you have a VPN.
Fortunately we DO have a VPN (Identity Cloaker, 5*) and this is the
method we will use for TV when we go back after house sale and want to
watch TV with no 1.4m dish to receive a satellite signal.
If you will be setting up a UK home with broadband, the cheapest
solution to getting a UK-hosted VPN is a Raspberry Pi connected to your
router. The broadcasters can't tell whether you're in your UK home or
elsewhere.
A ‘fruiter?
--
Toodle Pip
the Omrud
2018-07-14 18:35:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mike
Post by the Omrud
Post by BrritSki
We used to do that, but I'm now using Internet radio.  An old Android
phone works perfectly;  you can connect it to speakers, directly or
bluetooth, and you can use the iPlayer.
Won't work for TV of course, unless you have a VPN.
Fortunately we DO have a VPN (Identity Cloaker, 5*) and this is the
method we will use for TV when we go back after house sale and want to
watch TV with no 1.4m dish to receive a satellite signal.
If you will be setting up a UK home with broadband, the cheapest
solution to getting a UK-hosted VPN is a Raspberry Pi connected to your
router. The broadcasters can't tell whether you're in your UK home or
elsewhere.
A ‘fruiter?
Could be.
--
David
BrritSki
2018-07-15 06:38:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mike
Post by the Omrud
Post by BrritSki
We used to do that, but I'm now using Internet radio.  An old Android
phone works perfectly;  you can connect it to speakers, directly or
bluetooth, and you can use the iPlayer.
Won't work for TV of course, unless you have a VPN.
Fortunately we DO have a VPN (Identity Cloaker, 5*) and this is the
method we will use for TV when we go back after house sale and want to
watch TV with no 1.4m dish to receive a satellite signal.
If you will be setting up a UK home with broadband, the cheapest
solution to getting a UK-hosted VPN is a Raspberry Pi connected to your
router. The broadcasters can't tell whether you're in your UK home or
elsewhere.
A ‘fruiter?
:)
BrritSki
2018-07-15 06:37:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by the Omrud
Post by BrritSki
We used to do that, but I'm now using Internet radio.  An old Android
phone works perfectly;  you can connect it to speakers, directly or
bluetooth, and you can use the iPlayer.
Won't work for TV of course, unless you have a VPN.
Fortunately we DO have a VPN (Identity Cloaker, 5*) and this is the
method we will use for TV when we go back after house sale and want to
watch TV with no 1.4m dish to receive a satellite signal.
If you will be setting up a UK home with broadband, the cheapest
solution to getting a UK-hosted VPN is a Raspberry Pi connected to your
router.  The broadcasters can't tell whether you're in your UK home or
elsewhere.
Interesting. How do I connect to it from abroad though ?

A friend has been visiting Ceriana from the UK and working every day for
a month simply by roaming using his UK phone and a 4G signal. Since
that's connected to a UK server he said that he didn't need a VPN and
could watch SKy and other UK TV stations without any problems.

I will try it when we get home next week and see what the download speed
is compared to my 4Mbps "broadband" speed. In the UK I think I willhave
to go with BT myself as I already pay for BT Sport which will make the
package much cheaper than having a different BB provider.

SiL (sister, not son :) on whose behalf I asked a ? last week, was
having some problems with her broadband connection Thursday morning, so
I ran a speedtest. .19Mbps download 5 Mbps upload !!! I don't really
believe someone else was using up that bandwidth at 6.30 AM ! Later on
it was up to 30MBps upload which was more like it.

Later that day I collected my new Mitsubishi Outlander. Lovely :)
Btms
2018-07-15 07:35:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by BrritSki
Post by the Omrud
Post by BrritSki
We used to do that, but I'm now using Internet radio.  An old Android
phone works perfectly;  you can connect it to speakers, directly or
bluetooth, and you can use the iPlayer.
Won't work for TV of course, unless you have a VPN.
Fortunately we DO have a VPN (Identity Cloaker, 5*) and this is the
method we will use for TV when we go back after house sale and want to
watch TV with no 1.4m dish to receive a satellite signal.
If you will be setting up a UK home with broadband, the cheapest
solution to getting a UK-hosted VPN is a Raspberry Pi connected to your
router.  The broadcasters can't tell whether you're in your UK home or
elsewhere.
Interesting. How do I connect to it from abroad though ?
A friend has been visiting Ceriana from the UK and working every day for
a month simply by roaming using his UK phone and a 4G signal. Since
that's connected to a UK server he said that he didn't need a VPN and
could watch SKy and other UK TV stations without any problems.
I will try it when we get home next week and see what the download speed
is compared to my 4Mbps "broadband" speed. In the UK I think I willhave
to go with BT myself as I already pay for BT Sport which will make the
package much cheaper than having a different BB provider.
SiL (sister, not son :) on whose behalf I asked a ? last week, was
having some problems with her broadband connection Thursday morning, so
I ran a speedtest. .19Mbps download 5 Mbps upload !!! I don't really
believe someone else was using up that bandwidth at 6.30 AM ! Later on
it was up to 30MBps upload which was more like it.
Later that day I collected my new Mitsubishi Outlander. Lovely :)
Have a great trip and enjoy the new wheels. I think my neighbours both
have the same (one each) which suggests satisfaction.
--
BTMS - Equine Advisor Extraordinaire.
the Omrud
2018-07-15 13:49:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by BrritSki
Post by the Omrud
Post by BrritSki
We used to do that, but I'm now using Internet radio.  An old
Android phone works perfectly;  you can connect it to speakers,
directly or bluetooth, and you can use the iPlayer.
Won't work for TV of course, unless you have a VPN.
Fortunately we DO have a VPN (Identity Cloaker, 5*) and this is the
method we will use for TV when we go back after house sale and want
to watch TV with no 1.4m dish to receive a satellite signal.
If you will be setting up a UK home with broadband, the cheapest
solution to getting a UK-hosted VPN is a Raspberry Pi connected to
your router.  The broadcasters can't tell whether you're in your UK
home or elsewhere.
Interesting. How do I connect to it from abroad though ?
You run an Open Source VPN client on the device you want to connect.
Phones, tablets and computers are easy. Chromecasts are Quite
Difficult. Fire Sticks are a little fiddly, but fairly simple.

https://www.sitepoint.com/setting-up-a-home-vpn-using-your-raspberry-pi/

It has the further benefit of putting your remote device *inside* your
house while the VPN is connected, so you can get hold of any data held
on your NAS or whatever.
Post by BrritSki
A friend has been visiting Ceriana from the UK and working every day for
a month simply by roaming using his UK phone and a 4G signal. Since
that's connected to a UK server he said that he didn't need a VPN and
could watch SKy and other UK TV stations without any problems.
Nonsense. Nonsense twice. It's not connected to a UK server, and he's
not gaming the system. 4G roaming or local broadband, it would make no
difference.

The telcos know perfectly well where he is. But an EU law from April
2018 made it mandatory for TV streaming services (Netflix, Sky, Amazon
Prime) to give users the same service that they have paid for at home,
no matter where they are in the EU, "for a temporary period". The
latter is not defined.

BBC, Channel4, ITV, etc, are not covered by this and cannot be streamed
from outside the UK unless you fool them with a VPN.
Post by BrritSki
I will try it when we get home next week and see what the download speed
is compared to my 4Mbps "broadband" speed. In the UK I think I willhave
to go with BT myself as I already pay for BT Sport which will make the
package much cheaper than having a different BB provider.
If you have an Italian streaming contract then it will work in the UK
just as it does in Italy. But you won't get the UK content, which might
be better. We used to enjoy French Netflix when in France because it
had different programmes available, but we can't get it now on our account.

Heaven knows what will happen in 2021.
--
David
BrritSki
2018-07-15 17:27:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by the Omrud
Post by BrritSki
Post by the Omrud
Post by BrritSki
We used to do that, but I'm now using Internet radio.  An old
Android phone works perfectly;  you can connect it to speakers,
directly or bluetooth, and you can use the iPlayer.
Won't work for TV of course, unless you have a VPN.
Fortunately we DO have a VPN (Identity Cloaker, 5*) and this is the
method we will use for TV when we go back after house sale and want
to watch TV with no 1.4m dish to receive a satellite signal.
If you will be setting up a UK home with broadband, the cheapest
solution to getting a UK-hosted VPN is a Raspberry Pi connected to
your router.  The broadcasters can't tell whether you're in your UK
home or elsewhere.
Interesting. How do I connect to it from abroad though ?
You run an Open Source VPN client on the device you want to connect.
Phones, tablets and computers are easy.  Chromecasts are Quite
Difficult.  Fire Sticks are a little fiddly, but fairly simple.
I understand the individual words, but not what to do :)
Post by the Omrud
https://www.sitepoint.com/setting-up-a-home-vpn-using-your-raspberry-pi/
I'll read that when it's needed, thanks :)
Post by the Omrud
It has the further benefit of putting your remote device *inside* your
house while the VPN is connected, so you can get hold of any data held
on your NAS or whatever.
Post by BrritSki
A friend has been visiting Ceriana from the UK and working every day
for a month simply by roaming using his UK phone and a 4G signal.
Since that's connected to a UK server he said that he didn't need a
VPN and could watch SKy and other UK TV stations without any problems.
Nonsense.  Nonsense twice.
<snip useful explanations>

Well that explains why he was able to watch the GP on Sky, it was
probably me who extended it "UK TV". But as I have a VPN anyway it's no
problem. I'll try this setup when we get back next week...
Fenny
2018-07-16 09:20:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by the Omrud
The telcos know perfectly well where he is. But an EU law from April
2018 made it mandatory for TV streaming services (Netflix, Sky, Amazon
Prime) to give users the same service that they have paid for at home,
no matter where they are in the EU, "for a temporary period". The
latter is not defined.
I thought I'd seen something about this earlier in the year. However,
when I was in Greece last month, neither Netflix nor Now TV would let
me watch anything as I wasn't in the UK. I use TunnelBear as a VPN
and even that wouldn't let me watch stuff.
--
Fenny
BrritSki
2018-07-16 11:04:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by Fenny
Post by the Omrud
The telcos know perfectly well where he is. But an EU law from April
2018 made it mandatory for TV streaming services (Netflix, Sky, Amazon
Prime) to give users the same service that they have paid for at home,
no matter where they are in the EU, "for a temporary period". The
latter is not defined.
I thought I'd seen something about this earlier in the year. However,
when I was in Greece last month, neither Netflix nor Now TV would let
me watch anything as I wasn't in the UK. I use TunnelBear as a VPN
and even that wouldn't let me watch stuff.
I sometimes find I have to close iPlayer, remove cookies and try several
times before it will let me in via IDC VPN.
the Omrud
2018-07-16 16:03:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by Fenny
Post by the Omrud
The telcos know perfectly well where he is. But an EU law from April
2018 made it mandatory for TV streaming services (Netflix, Sky, Amazon
Prime) to give users the same service that they have paid for at home,
no matter where they are in the EU, "for a temporary period". The
latter is not defined.
I thought I'd seen something about this earlier in the year. However,
when I was in Greece last month, neither Netflix nor Now TV would let
me watch anything as I wasn't in the UK. I use TunnelBear as a VPN
and even that wouldn't let me watch stuff.
It certainly should have worked. Was working in France at Easter.
--
David
Nick Odell
2018-07-17 22:17:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Fenny
Post by the Omrud
The telcos know perfectly well where he is. But an EU law from April
2018 made it mandatory for TV streaming services (Netflix, Sky, Amazon
Prime) to give users the same service that they have paid for at home,
no matter where they are in the EU, "for a temporary period". The
latter is not defined.
I thought I'd seen something about this earlier in the year. However,
when I was in Greece last month, neither Netflix nor Now TV would let
me watch anything as I wasn't in the UK. I use TunnelBear as a VPN
and even that wouldn't let me watch stuff.
Maybe Greece is a noNetflix zone? Liliana has a Netflix account in
Argentina and it lets her watch Netflix when she's here in the UK. But -
and a very big but[1] - she may only watch the programmes available on
the UK version and has been unable to catch up on the various series she
was watching back home.

Nick
[1]No big butt jokes, thank you, Britters)
the Omrud
2018-07-18 08:06:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Nick Odell
The telcos know perfectly well where he is.  But an EU law from April
2018 made it mandatory for TV streaming services (Netflix, Sky, Amazon
Prime) to give users the same service that they have paid for at home,
no matter where they are in the EU, "for a temporary period".  The
latter is not defined.
I thought I'd seen something about this earlier in the year.  However,
when I was in Greece last month, neither Netflix nor Now TV would let
me watch anything as I wasn't in the UK.  I use TunnelBear as a VPN
and even that wouldn't let me watch stuff.
Maybe Greece is a noNetflix zone? Liliana has a Netflix account in
Argentina and it lets her watch Netflix when she's here in the UK. But -
and a very big but[1] - she may only watch the programmes available on
the UK version and has been unable to catch up on the various series she
was watching back home.
Right. The new rule is EU only. If you have a Netflix account from
outside the EU, or you travel outside the EU, then you will see whatever
is available to users in the country where you log in. This can be
beneficial - we could watch programmes in the US which are not shown in
the UK.
--
David
Chris McMillan
2018-07-14 15:11:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by Kate B
Post by Penny
On 13 Jul 2018 13:21:05 GMT, Sally Thompson
Post by Sally Thompson
The servants’ bells don’t appear to work these days:-)
I vaguely recall they did work in the house I grew up in but were
disconnected by my father when he replaced bell pushes with 2 pin sockets
and made use of the circuitry to put speakers in some rooms, connected to
the single household wireless. Probably so we could all listen to The
Archers while eating supper.
That was very enterprising! We still have the circuits in our house
(1912, it says on a drainpipe, though I suspect these bells are from the
thirties). There are still bell pushes in several rooms, if you depress
them there is a nasty dull buzzing from the box in the kitchen, though
the room tell-tales don't all work very well. Perhaps they rang properly
once upon a time. We also have an ancient electric doorbell which
irritates the bell in the kitchen - it doesn't exactly ring, it wobbles
crossly.
Wow!

Sincerely Chris
Fenny
2018-07-14 20:44:46 UTC
Permalink
On 13 Jul 2018 13:21:05 GMT, Sally Thompson
The servants’ bells don’t appear to work these days:-)
You just can't get the staff, especially with Brexit meaning Brexit.
--
Fenny
Penny
2018-07-14 22:24:21 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 14 Jul 2018 21:44:46 +0100, Fenny <***@removethis.gmail.com>
scrawled in the dust...
Post by Penny
On 13 Jul 2018 13:21:05 GMT, Sally Thompson
The servants’ bells don’t appear to work these days:-)
You just can't get the staff, especially with Brexit meaning Brexit.
An elderly friend of mine always greeted visitors with, "Sorry about the
mess, maid's day off."
--
Penny
Annoyed by The Archers since 1959
Mike
2018-07-15 07:56:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Penny
scrawled in the dust...
Post by Penny
On 13 Jul 2018 13:21:05 GMT, Sally Thompson
The servants’ bells don’t appear to work these days:-)
You just can't get the staff, especially with Brexit meaning Brexit.
An elderly friend of mine always greeted visitors with, "Sorry about the
mess, maid's day off."
We give both maids 7 days off every week.
--
Toodle Pip
Jenny M Benson
2018-07-17 13:59:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by Penny
scrawled in the dust...
Post by Penny
On 13 Jul 2018 13:21:05 GMT, Sally Thompson
Post by Sally Thompson
The servants’ bells don’t appear to work these days:-)
You just can't get the staff, especially with Brexit meaning Brexit.
An elderly friend of mine always greeted visitors with, "Sorry about the
mess, maid's day off."
That latter bit was what my father always said when telling us to tidy up.
--
Jenny M Benson
http://jennygenes.blogspot.co.uk/
krw
2018-07-10 10:53:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
I'm still bemused by why property prices have done what they have, on
supply and demand principles: 30 years ago, say, it was possible for
_many_ people to anticipate owning their own home by a reasonable point
in their life, and the population hasn't changed _that_ much over that
time;
The change in total population is bigger than you might think. 1985
56.5m 2015 65.1m 15%. Together with the other effects mentioned (more
single people etc.
--
Kosmo Richard W
www.travelswmw.whitnet.uk
https://tinyurl.com/KRWpics
Serena Blanchflower
2018-07-17 13:19:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by Btms
Saw a planning app today. Eight affordable houses. In that area I doubt
there is any property that would be valued at less than 500K . So based on
affordable means sold for average in the area, I will be interested to see
what happens next. Very few folk would afford 500K or anything like.
I saw a friend this morning, who happens to be a trustee of a local
Community Land Trust and thought to ask him about this.

He couldn't remember the precise definition of what constitutes
affordable housing but there's a formula laid down based on the local
market rate.

There are three separate tiers of affordable housing:

There are the houses Emma wants, being sold outright, at a discount from
the full, local, market rate.

There's the intermediate tier, which he knows best, which includes
houses being sold with shared ownership with a Community Land Trust, or
similar, owning the remaining half. It will also have rented
accommodation, also cheaper than local private rentals. I can't help
suspecting that this last group is the kind of housing Ed and Emma would
have the best chance of getting.

Finally, there's Social housing, is what used to be council housing but
is now, more often managed by Housing Associations. I don't know how
the rents (or tenancy agreements) for social housing compare with those
offered by Community Land Trusts. I doubt that Ambridge will be getting
any of these though.
--
Best wishes, Serena
The miracle is not to walk on water. The miracle is to walk on the green
earth, dwelling deeply in the present moment and feeling truly alive.
(Thich Nhat Hanh)
krw
2018-07-17 13:27:15 UTC
Permalink
I doubt that Ambridge will be getting any of these though.
I assume Bert Horrobin is in Social Housing and indeed I thought The
Green was all originally social housing. I do not know how many houses
comprise the Green.
--
Kosmo Richard W
www.travelswmw.whitnet.uk
https://tinyurl.com/KRWpics
Serena Blanchflower
2018-07-17 14:18:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by krw
I doubt that Ambridge will be getting any of these though.
I assume Bert Horrobin is in Social Housing and indeed I thought The
Green was all originally social housing.  I do not know how many houses
comprise the Green.
I was talking about the new houses that Justin's building, so I should
have said "I doubt that Ambridge will be getting any more of these though.".

Certainly The Green was originally social housing. ISTR one of the
stories which was picked up and then dropped included Tracy Horrobin
trying (and, I think, succeeding) in getting Bert to allow her to buy
their house. It sounded as if he was in extreme danger of then being
thrown out. Like you, I'm not sure how many houses there are on The
Green but the impression I've always had is that there probably aren't
much more than half a dozen houses or so. Maybe three or four pairs of
semis.
--
Best wishes, Serena
Q. What do you call a man with a bulldozer on his head?
A. Squashed
Btms
2018-07-17 15:48:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by Serena Blanchflower
Post by krw
I doubt that Ambridge will be getting any of these though.
I assume Bert Horrobin is in Social Housing and indeed I thought The
Green was all originally social housing.  I do not know how many houses
comprise the Green.
I was talking about the new houses that Justin's building, so I should
have said "I doubt that Ambridge will be getting any more of these though.".
Certainly The Green was originally social housing. ISTR one of the
stories which was picked up and then dropped included Tracy Horrobin
trying (and, I think, succeeding) in getting Bert to allow her to buy
their house. It sounded as if he was in extreme danger of then being
thrown out. Like you, I'm not sure how many houses there are on The
Green but the impression I've always had is that there probably aren't
much more than half a dozen houses or so. Maybe three or four pairs of
semis.
I live in a small village. We have no Social Housing and a recent planning
application which included some provision was dropped. Thank goodness.
--
BTMS - Equine Advisor Extraordinaire.
Nick Odell
2018-07-17 22:22:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Btms
Post by Serena Blanchflower
Post by krw
I doubt that Ambridge will be getting any of these though.
I assume Bert Horrobin is in Social Housing and indeed I thought The
Green was all originally social housing.  I do not know how many houses
comprise the Green.
I was talking about the new houses that Justin's building, so I should
have said "I doubt that Ambridge will be getting any more of these though.".
Certainly The Green was originally social housing. ISTR one of the
stories which was picked up and then dropped included Tracy Horrobin
trying (and, I think, succeeding) in getting Bert to allow her to buy
their house. It sounded as if he was in extreme danger of then being
thrown out. Like you, I'm not sure how many houses there are on The
Green but the impression I've always had is that there probably aren't
much more than half a dozen houses or so. Maybe three or four pairs of
semis.
I live in a small village. We have no Social Housing and a recent planning
application which included some provision was dropped. Thank goodness.
Good job I caught sight of your irony smiley otherwise I might have
assumed you lived in Nimby, near Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells.

Nick
Btms
2018-07-18 07:37:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Nick Odell
Post by Btms
Post by Serena Blanchflower
Post by krw
I doubt that Ambridge will be getting any of these though.
I assume Bert Horrobin is in Social Housing and indeed I thought The
Green was all originally social housing.  I do not know how many houses
comprise the Green.
I was talking about the new houses that Justin's building, so I should
have said "I doubt that Ambridge will be getting any more of these though.".
Certainly The Green was originally social housing. ISTR one of the
stories which was picked up and then dropped included Tracy Horrobin
trying (and, I think, succeeding) in getting Bert to allow her to buy
their house. It sounded as if he was in extreme danger of then being
thrown out. Like you, I'm not sure how many houses there are on The
Green but the impression I've always had is that there probably aren't
much more than half a dozen houses or so. Maybe three or four pairs of
semis.
I live in a small village. We have no Social Housing and a recent planning
application which included some provision was dropped. Thank goodness.
Good job I caught sight of your irony smiley otherwise I might have
assumed you lived in Nimby, near Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells.
Nick
The thank goodness is because there is more to it than providing houses.
One major issue is the poor quality of the sewage management which makes
building a number of new houses problematic whether private or public,if
the infrastructure is not developed at the same time. Where there are some
Local Authority houses (all privately owned now) there are parking/safety
problems because there was no provision back in he day. It is dangerous
and would be more dangerous if more houses without enough parking spaces
were allowed. No transport, no schools, no doctors etc anyone living here
must afford taxis or cars. We have no shops; the community one closed
because it kept being burgled/vandalised. I wouldn’t want to live here
with young children unless I had the income to support needs beyond a house
alone. It isn’t just about houses. Because the main industry is one
where drugs are around we have a social problem linked to this in the wider
area.

I am glad the application to build 100 new homes to include some affordable
housing was withdrawn.
--
BTMS - Equine Advisor Extraordinaire.
Vicky Ayech
2018-07-18 08:32:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by Btms
Post by Nick Odell
Post by Btms
Se
I live in a small village. We have no Social Housing and a recent planning
application which included some provision was dropped. Thank goodness.
Good job I caught sight of your irony smiley otherwise I might have
assumed you lived in Nimby, near Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells.
Nick
The thank goodness is because there is more to it than providing houses.
One major issue is the poor quality of the sewage management which makes
building a number of new houses problematic whether private or public,if
the infrastructure is not developed at the same time. Where there are some
Local Authority houses (all privately owned now) there are parking/safety
problems because there was no provision back in he day. It is dangerous
and would be more dangerous if more houses without enough parking spaces
were allowed. No transport, no schools, no doctors etc anyone living here
must afford taxis or cars. We have no shops; the community one closed
because it kept being burgled/vandalised. I wouldn’t want to live here
with young children unless I had the income to support needs beyond a house
alone. It isn’t just about houses. Because the main industry is one
where drugs are around we have a social problem linked to this in the wider
area.
I am glad the application to build 100 new homes to include some affordable
housing was withdrawn.
This is a development less than 10 years old. It includes houses and
flats that are owned and lots of social houseing of various kinds.
There was a school here already, just over the road. Unfortunately
their field is there too and annual sports day is a PITA with a
teacher who thinks he is witty and has a loud speaker. They have
several practise days before the actual one :(.

There are 3 supermarkets more or less on site, a big one, a
medium-sized one and a tiny little garage one, 3 bears style :). There
is a Dr's surgery in one supermarket car park, with a second 5 minutes
away and 3 pharmacies. There is under cover and outdoor parking,
although never enough. There are buses and good access to main roads
and main line stations near by, but the one thing not done well is, as
you mention, sewage. We practically have a permanent onsite Dynarod
van in attendance. And the specs for even the owned houses, of which I
have one, are very iffy in terms of sewage.

There is a small playground in the middle and a recreation ground with
playground and tennis courts very close, but the other #fail is post
boxes. And Post Offices. The nearest boxes are too far now for B to
walk easily and the PO is further. One box, close by, was closed for
no reason.

We do have a drug problem in the area and police cars cruise on
Saturday nights, but I like living here. Things are convenient and I
like summer evenings walking the dog around, children playing and
coming to say hello. People seem to be nice. One bad thing besides the
sewers, which don't impact really, is the air quality, which is bad as
major roads are near by.

Chris McMillan
2018-07-17 20:16:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by krw
I doubt that Ambridge will be getting any of these though.
I assume Bert Horrobin is in Social Housing and indeed I thought The
Green was all originally social housing. I do not know how many houses
comprise the Green.
Is Bert still alive? Not heard Soozan mutter about looking after him for
ages, never mind Cloive or Tracee.

Sincerely Chris
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